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ALPINE CDA9833R un CDA9835R regulēšanas iespējas

Par šo aparātu (9835) jau rakstījām. Daudzi ir sapriecājušies par tajos iebūvētajām plašajām regulēšanas iespējām, it sevišķi laika kavējumiem uz visiem 6 kanāliem (lineārajām izejām, vai visām 4 iebūvētā pastiprinātāja izejām), kā arī iebūvētajiem aktīvajiem filtriem uz šiem kanāliem. Ar laika kavējumiem viss ir skaidrs, tur nekādas viltības nevar būt. Bet ar filtriem jau ir savādāk.

Sākumā visi sapriecājas, ka nu tik dalīs joslas trīskomponentu akustikai utml. Bet viss nemaz nav tik rožaini. Tāpēc mēģināšu apstāstīt, ko tad īsti, ar šajos aparātos iebūvētajiem filtriem, var izdarīt.
Šajos aparātos ir divi filtru režīmi - 2way (2joslu) un 3way (3joslu).

Sāksim ar 2joslu režīmu. Skatāmies tabulu no lietotāja instrukcijas.

Dalījuma frekvence
(solis 1/3oct)

Stāvums

HPF

LPF

HPF

LPF

Zemo frekvenču skaļrunis

-----

20Hz-200Hz

-----

FLAT, 6, 12, 18, 24 dB/oct

Aizmugurējie augstfrekvenču skaļruņi

20Hz-200Hz

-----

FLAT, 6, 12, 18, 24 dB/oct

-----

Priekšējie augstfrekvenču skaļruņi

20Hz-200Hz

-----

FLAT, 6, 12, 18, 24 dB/oct

-----

Sākam lasīt tabulu no augšas un tur jau uzreiz izlasām, ka dalījuma frekvence regulējas diskrēti, ar 1/3oct soli. Līdz ar to nevarēsim ieregulēt dalījuma frekvenci, kādi vien vēlamies atvēlētajā diapazonā, bet būs jāizvēlas no frekvenču rindas, kāda visvairāk der.
Šim režīmam galvenais pielietojums ir sistēmā, kur no "galvas" darbojas priekšējā un aizmugurējā akustika, kas strādā vai nu pilnā joslā, vai arī tai ir nogrieztas zemākās frekvences joslā no 20-200Hz. Tas nozīmē, ka nebūs vairs jāmoka priekšējie 10cm (kas ir plāsi izplatīts standarts priekšā jau no rūpnīcas) skaļruņi ar basiem, jo šādi skaļruņi parasti normāli sāk skanēt no 150-200Hz. Ja uzliktu stāvumu 24dB/oct, tad arī no 100Hz. Arī tik iemīļotajām 6x9 collu elipsēm aizmugurē varēsim noņemt pašus zemākos basus, jo arī tās nemaz tik ļoti tos nemīl. Lai gan parasti šie skaļruņi tiek nežēlīgi mocīti ar visādiem "bass boostiem" un "loudiem". Sabvūferu šajā režīmā var pieslēgt tikai caur lineāro izeju. Līdz ar to būs nepieciešams vai nu aktīvais sabs, vai atsevišķs zemo frekvenču skaļrunis atbilstošā akustiskā noformējumā komplektā ar skaļruņa spējām atbilstošu pastiprinātāju. Ja mēs uz katru kanālu liekam atsevišķu pastiprinātāju, tad faktiski "galvā" iebūvētie filtri ir lieki, jo pastiprinātājos iebūvētajiem filtriem bieži vien ir plašāks regulēšanas diapazons. Vienīgi, ka "galvā" iebūvētajiem filtriem var mainīt nogriešanas stāvumu.

3 joslu režīms

Dalījuma frekvence
(solis 1/3oct)

Stāvums

HPF

LPF

HPF

LPF

Zemo frekvenču skaļrunis

-----

20Hz-200Hz

-----

FLAT, 6, 12, 18, 24 dB/oct

Midbasu skaļrunis

20Hz-200Hz

20Hz-20kHz

FLAT, 6, 12, 18, 24 dB/oct

FLAT, 6, 12, 18, 24 dB/oct

Augsto frekvenču skaļruņi

1kHz-20kHz

-----

FLAT, 6, 12, 18, 24 dB/oct

-----

Šis režīms atklāj šī aparāta galveno pielietojuma jomu - 2komponentu priekšējā akustika un sabvūfers. Sabvūferam, tāpat kā iepriekšējā režīmā vajadzēs savu atsevišķu pastiprinātāju, bet frontālo akustiku jau var darbināt no iebūvēta pastiprinātāja, pie tam, pīkstuļus no priekšējiem kanāliem, basiniekus no aizmugurējiem. Lai gan arī šoreiz ne bez mīnusiem. Iepriekš jau minējām, ka dalījuma frekvenci var mainīt diskrēti ar 1/3oct soli. Šis faktors atkal neļaus izvēlēties labāko no dalījuma frekvencēm starp pīkstuli un midbasu. Šajā joslā 1/3oct sanāk jau ļoti rupjš dalījums, t.i. sekojošas frekvences - 1; 1,2; 1,6; 2; 2,5; 3,2; 4; 5; 6,3kHz. Līdz ar to atkal jāsāk domāt, vai labāk nav paņemt pastiprinātāju ar plaša regulēšanas diapazona iebūvētajiem filtriem, jo tos var regulēt plūstoši. Vienīgi nogriešanas stāvums tiem parasti ir 12dB/oct. Katrā gadījumā līdz atsevišķam pastiprinātājam ar laiku tik un tā nonāks.

Šajā režīmā ir iespējams vēl viens viltīgs slēgums, gadījumam, ja sistēmu komplektējat pakāpeniski, kas ir bieža prakse. Un tas ir, var arī pieslēgt frontālo akustiku un sabvūferu pie "galvā" iebūvētā pastiprinātāja. Pie priekšējiem kanāliem protams slēdzam frontālo akustiku. Filtru jāieslēdz FLAT režīmā, t.i. to jāatslēdz. Varbūt var arī uzlikt 1000Hz HPF ar 6dB/oct stāvumu, ja ir kaut kāda kaprīza frontālā akustika. Pie aizmugurējiem kanāliem, protams slēdzam divspoļu (tikai 2x4omi) sabu. Un te jau mums filtri ļauj viņu ierobežot joslā no 20Hz līdz pat 20kHz, lai gan pietiks ar diapazonu no 20Hz līdz kādiem 100Hz.

Ja runājam par 3komponentu akustiku un sabvūferu, tad jāsaka, ka "galvā" iebūvētie filtri šādam režīmam ir vismazāk piemēroti, tos var lietot tikai kombinācijā ar kādu citu aktīvo filtru, pasīvajiem filtriem vai arī pastiprinātājos iebūvētajiem filtriem.
Vismazāk šādai sistēmai der 2joslu režīms, jo tajā ar iebūvētajiem filtriem var nodalīt tikai sabvūferu no pārējās akustikas. Varētu jau arī 200Hz dalījumu likt starp difuzora tipa vidējo frekvenču skaļruni un basinieka/sabvūfera diapazonu, tikai tad midbasa un sabvūfer pastiprinātājs/-i jādarbina no vienas lineārās izejas, kas neļaus vairs tiem uzlikt laika kavējumus.
3joslu režīmā arī nevar izdarīt neko vairāk. Ja nu vienīgi mēs dalām basinieku ar vidinieku pie 1000Hz. Mēs pat tad varam darbināt frontālo akustiku no "galvā" iebūvētā pastprinātāja - basinieki no aizmugurējiem kanāliem, vidinieki un pīkstuļi caur pasīvo filtru no priekšējiem kanāliem. Mēs gan tad daudz zaudējam, jo kupoltipa vidinieki, ja ar tiem godīgi apietas, var sākt strādāt jau pat no 400Hz.

Secinājumi. Šajos aparātos iebūvētie filtri vislabāk derēs frekvenču sadalīšanai sistēmā, kas sastāvēs no sabvūfera un 2koponentu frontālās akustikas, ar nosacījumu, ka frontālās akustikas komponentes tiks īpaši piemeklētas izejot no iespējamo dalījuma frekvenču diskrētuma, t.i. īpaša uzmanība jāpievērš pīkstuļa rezonanses frekvencei.

juriz

Iesūtīja juriz, 2004-09-27 10:46:22 (apskatīts: 7852 reizes).

Komentāri par šo rakstu:
2004-09-27 11:52:47
hotinfo rakstīja:
juriz, izlabo virsrakstu! (9835 nevis 55).
un 2 joslas + subs sisteemaa nav nekaadu nosaciijumu - var sadaliit jebkuru sisteemu, piixtilim HPF tachu jau var saakot no 1kHz iestaadiit, zemaak jau nu gan nebuutu logjiski daliit. man vismaz ar iPersonalize izdevaas piemekleet tieshi taadus daliijumus kaadus vien vareeju izdomaat.
Vai ari es kaut ko nesapratu no tava raxta :).
2004-09-27 11:54:53
hotinfo rakstīja:
iPersonalize var katrs pats izmeegjinaat alpine usa web saitaa http://www.alpine-usa.com/
Tur vajadzees ieprieksh pieregjistreeties.
2004-09-27 12:05:20
juriz rakstīja:
i-Personalize ir arī www.alpine-europe.com
Pīkstulim var uzlikt frekvences sākot ar 1kHz (un zemāk nekādi, ja nu vienīgi atslēgt), bet solis ta ir 1/3 oct, kas sanāk sekojošas frekvences 1; 1,2; 1,6; 2; 2,5; 3,2; 4; 5; 6,3kHz utt.
2004-09-27 12:13:46
hotinfo rakstīja:
un kas vainas shiim frekvenceem? zemaak par 1k jau nu gan tas vairs nebuus nekaads piixtulis, a par 3 josu sisteemaam Neviens jau sen raxtiija ka alpains tur nederees.. tur vajag magji ar 4x izejaam un 4 pastuuzhus :)))
2004-09-27 13:07:43
Neviens rakstīja:
Vot neiru gan obzerveejis nekaadus 4x izeju magjus... tad tur vajag c90 ar 4000 proci, vai 9. pioneer ar proci... izmaxas - mamma mia! :)))
Ir variants protams arii ar Alpaina iebuuveeto... aizmirstam par kupolvidiem kaa sugu, samekleejam labus difuzorniekus un noformeejumu tiem, lai ar garantiju speelee no 200Hz un midbasu no suba savukaart dalaam ar ampos iebuuveetajiem filtriem. Shaadaa variantaa laikam jau nevajadzeetu abiem zemajiem ch ieksh galvas likt atshkjiriigas aiztures, jo peec tam summeejot signaalu uz subu var sanaakt dieva briinumi... nu un suba ampam ljoti sveetiiga buutu faazes piereguleeshanas iespeeja.
Vai tas viss autinjaa ir vajadziigs... tip 300Ls galva + 3joslu front + subs + ampi ar minimums 7ch, kas viss kopaa maksaa... pareekjiniet gan! :)) Es nu nepavisam neesmu paarliecinaats :))
2004-09-27 13:48:58
Laurenss rakstīja:
vai praatiigaak nebuutu uz vien kanaala laist nevis midbasu un subu, bet gan piikstuli un vidu?

atsleedzam piikstulja flitru magjii, starp piikstuli un vidu liekam pasiivo, vai filtreejam ar amp filtru, vidu no apakshas arii ar pasiivo, vai amp filtru. midbasu no augshas jau var filtreet ar iebuuveeto.

p.s. piikstuli un vidu skaljrunji liekam maksimali tuvu (kopaa) un aiztures liekam kaa vienam kanaalam.
2004-09-27 17:22:14
Neviens rakstīja:
Es ljoooooooti nerekomendeetu taa dariit... teoreetisko pamatojumu ar faazu nobiideem, etc milzu palagaa ar kreiso roku es ir par slinku te drukjeet :)
2004-09-27 19:41:30
hotinfo rakstīja:
vai tad nu tik traki buus. sanaaks taads pats 'koaksiaalis' kaa taviem kantoniem. Tobish reduceejam 3 joslu sisteemu par 2 joslu ('apvienojot' piixtuli un vidinieku) un taalaak jau liekam aiztures kaa vienam skaljrunim. protams, ka fiziski arii piixtulis un vidinieks buus jaanovieto viens otram blakus.
2004-09-27 20:57:59
Neviens rakstīja:
Ne tur taa probleema. Probleema ieksh taa, ka tad ar iebuuveeto xoveru midu no apakshas var daliit ne zemaak par 1khz - ja tas ir khz nevis paarsimts hz, tad tie ir pilniigi lieki izdevumi, lieks chakaris un 95% droshi, ka nebuus labaak par 2joslu front daliitu uz 3khz.
Savukaart izteiktaa ideja par midbasa filtrteeshanu no augshas ar iebuuveeto un midu no apakshas ar ampa filtru, vai vispaar pasiivo - var iebraukt taaaadaaaas auzaas ar faazeem un sliktaakais - ampeleeshanaas ar aiztureem taas faazu auzas neizlabos ne par kripatu. Es nesaku, ka 100% noteikti buus auzas, bet iespeeja ir vairaak nekaa ticama. Es shaadaa risinaajumaa neieguldiitu ne santiima(!!), ja vien ieprieksh neko nemaksaajot to vareetu salikt un eksperimentaali noklausiities.
2004-09-27 21:48:00
hotinfo rakstīja:
tev tev tachu vidus + piixtulis ir tieshi taa sadaliiti, ar pasiivajiem filtriem! nav jau obligaati jaaizmanto ampa filtri, briiva izveele - taisiit pasham savus pasiivos, pirkt gatavus, izmantot pastuuzha iebuuveetos, izmantot atsevishkju atktiivo xoveri vai to visu kombineet... protams ka pastaav iespeeja iebraukt auzaas, bet tad jau var arii to pashu alpine galvu sareguleet nepareizi, vai ne? :)
2004-10-03 10:58:29
reaktors rakstīja:
man pilnigi pofig kas tur ar filtriem un kaa,bet magjis ir afigiteljnijs:) nav labaaka,vinnss ir radiits priekss manis :DDDD
2004-10-03 12:58:34
garais77 rakstīja:
A kāda šitiem maģiem ir trokšņu attiecība -db ?
2004-10-04 06:21:11
hotinfo rakstīja:
95db vai 100dB vai 105dB - starpiibas tachu tik un taa nav...
Shiem modeljiem Signal-to-Noise (S/N) : 105dB.
2010-06-17 12:19:00
pinguin rakstīja:
Kļūda - krosoveris pielauj HI apaksejo dalījuma frekvenci ari zem 1 khz - līdz pat pasai apakšai, tikai settingos ir jāaktivizē viens parametrs!
2012-12-10 10:35:00
l88 rakstīja:
Kāds parametrs?
2015-12-10 04:33:00
oakleysunglasses rakstīja:

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